Dallas Fort Worth Urban Forum

Preston Center

itsjrd1964
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Preston Center

Postby itsjrd1964 » 27 Aug 2018 18:43

A Target is set to open in Preston Center Pavilion (the ex-Sanger Harris/ex-Foley's store space) in a former Ross store. It will be 30% the size of a SuperTarget. The DMN is reporting that signage has already gone up outside the building. The Target will open in October.

https://www.dallasnews.com/business/ret ... ll-opening

Tnexster
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Re: Preston Center

Postby Tnexster » 27 Aug 2018 21:37

Wow that is a fast turnaround, have then been working on that for a while? Maybe we will see one of these downtown before too long.

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uptown74
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Re: Preston Center

Postby uptown74 » 28 Aug 2018 22:03

I was hoping one of these urban Targets would open in the Centrum building on Oaklawn (as rumored) , but it never happened..

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Tivo_Kenevil
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Re: Preston Center

Postby Tivo_Kenevil » 28 Aug 2018 22:54

Oak Cliff desperately needs an urban Target.

cowboyeagle05
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Re: Preston Center

Postby cowboyeagle05 » 29 Aug 2018 09:09

The demo isn't in Oak Cliff for an Urban Target as much as my friends who have moved there want it to be. My friends keep complaining about a lack of the stores they want down there but I ask them to look at where they are and the price they are paying to live there. If you are going to be an urban pioneer you have to expect to hunt down your buffalo a little further than the white flight Plano suburbs which have a dry good store on every corner.

lakewoodhobo
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Re: Preston Center

Postby lakewoodhobo » 29 Aug 2018 09:48

Tivo_Kenevil wrote:Oak Cliff desperately needs an urban Target.


Oak Cliff (north of Red Bird) needs a Target for sure, I just don't see where the numbers would work for an urban concept.

A traditional Target store makes sense for the Canyon development, where I think the demographics would support it today. Several years down the road I could see Wynnewood making sense too... it's way more desirable now than Cityplace was in 1993 when Target opened there.

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tamtagon
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Re: Preston Center

Postby tamtagon » 29 Aug 2018 09:51

...or look more closely at what's already available in the neighborhood and see if the shopping list needs modification to break the habits and learned behavior also considered as that uber-convenient, on-demand suburban shopping expectation. haha doesn't seem like, really, but I am agreeing with cowboy, some of those folks wanting an Urban Target in Oak Cliff just need to look closer.

Buying stuff that's is not exactly what you know you can get at Target or Container Store or wherever but stuff is is pretty close is not settling for second best, it's supporting the stores that make the neighborhood desirable --- not like the cookie cutter suburbs. A thorough inventory of greater neighborhood stores' inventory could be a big surprise.

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NdoorTX
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Re: Preston Center

Postby NdoorTX » 06 Sep 2018 17:20

Saint Michael church teams up with developers for new mixed-use project in North Dallas
Steve Brown, Real Estate Editor

paraphrased
-The last large vacant development site in North Dallas' exclusive Preston Center district is being planned for a major mixed-use development.
Saint Michael and All Angels Episcopal Church has owned the almost 4-acre block at Douglas Avenue and Frederick Square for more than a decade.

-Now the church — which has been in Preston Center since 1948 — is teaming up with Dallas developer Lincoln Property Co. to build residential and commercial buildings as part of an expansion of the church's campus.

-The new proposal for the prime North Dallas tract includes an 8-story office building, restaurant space and a "public green space" on Douglas Avenue.
A 12-story residential building would be constructed on the west side of the property. Office towers which adjoin the church development site are 19 and 20 floors. And a residential condominium next door is 10 stories.

https://www.dallasnews.com/business/rea ... rth-dallas

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Tivo_Kenevil
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Re: Preston Center

Postby Tivo_Kenevil » 06 Sep 2018 17:26

Why are churches making developments?

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Warrior2015
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Re: Preston Center

Postby Warrior2015 » 06 Sep 2018 17:28

Tivo_Kenevil wrote:Why are churches making developments?

They're doing that in Downtown Austin as well

I45Tex
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Re: Preston Center

Postby I45Tex » 06 Sep 2018 19:34

It's a lot to do with cost of construction, I think? The article mentions the congregation's campus expansion. Rich suburbs of Boston now offer to give developers prime property with old city buildings on it in exchange for building them new municipal facilities just because adequate new facilities have gotten so prohibitive in the current tax environment. The federal GSA was even forced for awhile to start talking about doing that with one of the largest public buildings between the National Gallery of Art and the national capitol, which was unbelievable to me: https://www.gsa.gov/node/79728

I guess it has been found (in rare neighborhoods like downtown Austin / Preston Center) to make less sense for churches to sell off surplus holdings on the open market and reinvest the proceeds in ministry/property than to actually use those holdings as a bargaining chip with developers before they'll even let developers get a toehold there in the first place.

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tanzoak
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Re: Preston Center

Postby tanzoak » 06 Sep 2018 23:48

While I'm happy to have construction go in there, it's lame that it'll be shorter than the surrounding buildings.

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The_Overdog
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Re: Preston Center

Postby The_Overdog » 07 Sep 2018 08:52

Why are churches making developments?


It's actually pretty common. There are probably close to half-dozen church funded/property swap developments in Plano/Frisco/Richardson/Allen.

cowboyeagle05
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Re: Preston Center

Postby cowboyeagle05 » 07 Sep 2018 08:57

Plus churches are special they can do no wrong so there tend to be ways they can skirt a lot of taxes aka cost and churches in North Texas particularly are profit driven which I assume is because God deems it so...

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muncien
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Re: Preston Center

Postby muncien » 07 Sep 2018 10:14

cowboyeagle05 wrote:Plus churches are special they can do no wrong so there tend to be ways they can skirt a lot of taxes aka cost and churches in North Texas particularly are profit driven which I assume is because God deems it so...


They can also work with developer to ensure that whatever is built doesn't have excessive glare shining into the pulpit, serve alcohol until late hours, etc. Actually, it sounds like a very responsible approach, IMO.
"He doesn't know how to use the three seashells..."

itsjrd1964
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Re: Preston Center

Postby itsjrd1964 » 17 Oct 2018 04:57

Article about the new smaller-format Target at Preston Center.

https://www.dallasnews.com/business/ret ... mall-store

Tnexster
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Re: Preston Center

Postby Tnexster » 12 Nov 2018 08:48

We can free Preston Center from the 1960s

https://www.dallasnews.com/opinion/comm ... nter-1960s

itsjrd1964
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Re: Preston Center

Postby itsjrd1964 » 07 Jan 2019 21:03

D looks at 3 issues concerning those around the Preston Center area.

https://www.dmagazine.com/frontburner/2 ... on-center/

DPatel304
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Re: Preston Center

Postby DPatel304 » 04 Feb 2019 20:40

Dallas wants to plant a park over Preston Center's garage. The owners want 300 apartments
https://www.dallasnews.com/opinion/comm ... apartments

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NdoorTX
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Re: Preston Center

Postby NdoorTX » 06 Jun 2019 23:09

City Plan Commission Brings Surprisingly High Ending To Pink Wall’s Two-Year PD-15 Saga
by Jon Anderson


https://candysdirt.com/2019/06/06/city- ... d-15-saga/

So Preston Center/ Hollow area might get a new tall tower along NW Hwy? Sounds exciting...

Image

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Tivo_Kenevil
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Re: Preston Center

Postby Tivo_Kenevil » 07 Jun 2019 08:06

Not gonna lie... What a surprise.

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Dmkflyer
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Re: Preston Center

Postby Dmkflyer » 07 Jun 2019 11:25

DPatel304 wrote:Dallas wants to plant a park over Preston Center's garage. The owners want 300 apartments
https://www.dallasnews.com/opinion/comm ... apartments



I am not understanding why this can't be BOTH. Street-level park with underground parking and a residential tower (maybe even with some retail) taking up a portion (which could be smaller at the ground with height). I don't understand why this is not obvious--- there has to be something I'm missing. Even in that rendering in the article, just sinking the garage to make the park at ground-level could work.

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Dmkflyer
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Re: Preston Center

Postby Dmkflyer » 07 Jun 2019 11:25

The behind the Pink Wall development is a pleasant surprise!

cowboyeagle05
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Re: Preston Center

Postby cowboyeagle05 » 07 Jun 2019 13:08

I am telling you the neighborhood is afraid of a true park in Preston Center cause if successfully built at ground level even with a residential tower perched on one corner they could see a traffic increase relative to the success of Klyde Warren Park. A true ground level park could attract people from a wider market and while that seems like a good thing for the surrounding businesses I've seen some people in areas like Preston Center fear the outside non-neighborhood customer.

Tnexster
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Re: Preston Center

Postby Tnexster » 09 Aug 2019 21:40

In Preston Center, a stalemate over a parking garage Dallas owns and property owners control

https://www.dallasnews.com/opinion/comm ... rs-control

The surrounding property owners control the garage. That's because of a legally binding 2012 negotiated agreement, reached after many years in court, that says the property owners, as the Preston Center West Parking Corp., control the garage's destiny — and only with the owners' unanimous consent.

And the property owners all agree on what they want: a 300-unit apartment tower and park and restaurant on top of a parking garage built to hold more than 2,000 cars. The plan also calls for two smaller pocket parks. But moms and dads with kids and dogs would have to take an elevator to reach the actual park — a "vertical transportation system," in the words of property owner Robert Dozier, who first pitched this plan in January.


Image

cowboyeagle05
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Re: Preston Center

Postby cowboyeagle05 » 10 Aug 2019 10:15

I want to place this quote here because it won't be last time we hear this from various neighborhoods...

https://candysdirt.com/2019/08/08/pd-15-meeting-produced-packed-house-but-same-gripes/

If I could sum up the bizarre and illogical nature of the PD-15 opposition to development, it would be when the Athena’s Barbara Dewberry stood up and (again) shouted that the neighborhood doesn’t want green space that will attract outsiders. Making it more worthy of eye-rolling were those who clapped in support (although a few seated in the back of me said they welcomed green space in PD-15’s concrete jungle).


Some people look at successful urban parks in established areas as an invasion, not as an amenity or property value add.

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tamtagon
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Re: Preston Center

Postby tamtagon » 10 Aug 2019 10:58

If the park was intended to be nestled within the fine homes of the residential neighborhood, I would agree unequivocally, but this is a commercial center, that could become one of the most exclusive in the South Central US, so it needs the amenities that have a similar level of appeal. The NIMBY spirit here has become so twisted and blind and irreverent I have a hard time believing those holding fast to a position like that are any more informed than a pothole.

cowboyeagle05
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Re: Preston Center

Postby cowboyeagle05 » 10 Aug 2019 13:05

TRAFFIC TRAFFIC TRAFFIC!!!! The sky is falling!!!


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