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West End 1.0

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mdg109
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Re: West End 1.0

Postby mdg109 » 27 Mar 2018 12:59

Patios were pretty filled up this Sunday at West End. Here's 3Eleven. West End has so much potential.
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DPatel304
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Re: West End 1.0

Postby DPatel304 » 27 Mar 2018 13:06

Thanks for the picture updates. I definitely agree with the potential in the West End. Once the proposed West End park gets built, it will really change the area and tie everything together.

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mdg109
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Re: West End 1.0

Postby mdg109 » 28 Mar 2018 12:40

That and the new Holocaust Museum. It would also be cool if they got rid of the diagonal parking and made room for extra wide sidewalks for patios - even parallel parking would be better IMO.

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Tivo_Kenevil
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Re: West End 1.0

Postby Tivo_Kenevil » 28 Mar 2018 13:33

mdg109 wrote:That and the new Holocaust Museum. It would also be cool if they got rid of the diagonal parking and made room for extra wide sidewalks for patios - even parallel parking would be better IMO.

The side walks are fine. What they really need to do is remove the poles obstructing the foot path.

lakewoodhobo
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Re: West End 1.0

Postby lakewoodhobo » 28 Mar 2018 13:42

Not the most exciting update, but the fact that they've selected an architect for West End Plaza is a big step forward. They've always said that this project could be done quickly and at the same time as one of the other new parks, so who knows.

Screen Shot 2018-03-28 at 1.38.44 PM.jpg
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DPatel304
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Re: West End 1.0

Postby DPatel304 » 28 Mar 2018 13:51

It's such a small park, that I was hoping this would be one of the first they finish. Maybe this news does indicate things might start moving sooner rather than later.

Dallas sure does love over-doing it when it comes to their parks. I do like Klyde Warren and Main Street Garden, but it'd be nice to see some simpler parks that are just grass, trees, and some benches.

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Tivo_Kenevil
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Re: West End 1.0

Postby Tivo_Kenevil » 28 Mar 2018 17:35

DPatel304 wrote:It's such a small park, that I was hoping this would be one of the first they finish. Maybe this news does indicate things might start moving sooner rather than later.

Dallas sure does love over-doing it when it comes to their parks. I do like Klyde Warren and Main Street Garden, but it'd be nice to see some simpler parks that are just grass, trees, and some benches.



Fancy or bust!

lakewoodhobo
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Re: West End 1.0

Postby lakewoodhobo » 29 Mar 2018 10:46

DPatel304 wrote:Dallas sure does love over-doing it when it comes to their parks. I do like Klyde Warren and Main Street Garden, but it'd be nice to see some simpler parks that are just grass, trees, and some benches.


I think it's been discussed, but Dallas tried simple parks with benches and trees in the past and they failed miserably. Now that we have a better understanding of placement, programming and context maybe we'll get them right this time.

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The_Overdog
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Re: West End 1.0

Postby The_Overdog » 29 Mar 2018 11:06

I think it's been discussed, but Dallas tried simple parks with benches and trees in the past and they failed miserably


That's because parks with grass and benches are for one specific group - kids playing ball, and if you put too many trees in the way it defeats the purpose. If there are no kids around, then parks like that are totally useless. Dallas doesn't have that much concrete and development where grass is novel.

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Re: West End 1.0

Postby cowboyeagle05 » 29 Mar 2018 13:07

Then the complaint would be it's too hot. It's the same when they started building malls like Firewheel vs Towneast Mall. When they proposed Firewheel Garland citizens showed up complaining that it would never work in Texas. Citizens said build it on the East coast where its cooler and the developer said they do already and citizens there complain its too cold to build it in the warmer south.

I am certainly not against large open grassy lawns for kids to play in with some simple seating but they still have to be done with a certain amount of intelligence. The sculpture garden/smoker hangouts of the 1970-80's of Downtown Dallas certainly loss favor with landowners and the city alike. Programmed spaces are how we were able to drag people back to inner city parks so that the number of homeless vs everyone else was less obvious. I certainly hope we can build large lawns of multi-use space without programming things to the hilt.

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gshelton91
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Re: West End 1.0

Postby gshelton91 » 30 Mar 2018 14:17

DPatel304 wrote:It's such a small park, that I was hoping this would be one of the first they finish. Maybe this news does indicate things might start moving sooner rather than later.

Dallas sure does love over-doing it when it comes to their parks. I do like Klyde Warren and Main Street Garden, but it'd be nice to see some simpler parks that are just grass, trees, and some benches.


You know Dallas has well over 100 parks and 2 that have any kind of regular programing KWP and Main Street... I just don't see that having 2 parks with programing out of more than 100 parks that are just lawn and trees is "Over doing it" with fancy parks. I would say that we have the opposite problem tons of parks that cost of money to keep up but are so boring compared to what is in a typical back yard that people don't use them.

Side note... i was just in Houston and they have tons of parks with programming and the people were out enjoying them and loved it. I saw at least 4 parks with significant programming... compared to our 2.

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The_Overdog
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Re: West End 1.0

Postby The_Overdog » 02 Apr 2018 09:29

I saw at least 4 parks with significant programming... compared to our 2.


Klyde Warren Park was total madness on Friday night when I was there. Northpark at Christmas type madness. Another programmed park would actually be great.

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Re: West End 1.0

Postby cowboyeagle05 » 02 Apr 2018 10:38

Half of Klyde Warrens appeal is the gimmick of what it is. A park over a freeway and yes I believe that gimmick has lasting power as long as the park is maintained. The other half if its location. It is in a place where Plano moms and Uptownies alike feel safe. Not to mention tourists. It will be hard-pressed to make that magic happen again as easily. The South Dallas equivalent will struggle cause it doesn't have the pricey real estate companies as supporters along with a private entity to prop it up.

At least the West End park will have the West End Association along with the startup scene to keep it in front of mind along with new property owners like Granite to push for maintenance and improvements. The series of newer Downtown parks stay in the ok condition now because of the Downtown Dallas parks foundation which is trying to do what the city is bad at doing all over Dallas, ongoing maintenance. Lord knows endowments for park maintenance are a wonderful thing and the Downtown Dallas Parks group is trying to get more of that kind of financing in place for future park maintenance and renovation.

The West End has needed some public space since it became a The West End. I just hope they can deal with the homeless balance so much so that school buses who park nearby for the museums can safely hang out for lunches etc.

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Re: West End 1.0

Postby DPatel304 » 02 Apr 2018 10:46

gshelton91 wrote:You know Dallas has well over 100 parks and 2 that have any kind of regular programing KWP and Main Street... I just don't see that having 2 parks with programing out of more than 100 parks that are just lawn and trees is "Over doing it" with fancy parks. I would say that we have the opposite problem tons of parks that cost of money to keep up but are so boring compared to what is in a typical back yard that people don't use them.

Side note... i was just in Houston and they have tons of parks with programming and the people were out enjoying them and loved it. I saw at least 4 parks with significant programming... compared to our 2.


I guess that helps put things into perspective. My comment was just based on recent parks in the urban core (Klyde Warren, Main Street Garden, the proposed four parks Downtown, and the renderings of the Trinity River Park). I didn't really consider the fact that we already have so many that are non-programmed parks.

The_Overdog wrote:
I saw at least 4 parks with significant programming... compared to our 2.


Klyde Warren Park was total madness on Friday night when I was there. Northpark at Christmas type madness. Another programmed park would actually be great.


We do have Main Street Garden to try and help some of the traffic, but, from what I've seen, it doesn't have nearly the same amount of popularity as Klyde Warren Park.

Perhaps the West End will be different and will become more of a destination for people outside the urban core. Seeing as how the West End used to be a hot spot, maybe it's old reputation will help draw people back in. It also helps that it's so historic and unique looking for Dallas.

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maconahey
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Re: West End 1.0

Postby maconahey » 15 May 2018 09:47

Probably old, but I haven't seen this posted yet

Image

Image

Image

http://www.bokapowell.com/project/the-brewery-site/

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eburress
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Re: West End 1.0

Postby eburress » 15 May 2018 10:16

I've never seen that either. I wonder if this is a newer iteration of what had previously been planned for that site (the alternative version kept more of the existing structure).

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Tivo_Kenevil
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Re: West End 1.0

Postby Tivo_Kenevil » 15 May 2018 10:53

Is the brewery build redo?

Edit: it is! These are definitely new.

cowboyeagle05
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Re: West End 1.0

Postby cowboyeagle05 » 15 May 2018 13:09

It says in the description it was part of a design competition so I doubt these are whats planned anytime soon. BOKA just participated in the design competition and most likely weren't chosen based on the fact they were posted to the website like this.

There have been two proposals announced for the Brewery site. Before the Amazon proposal, the current owners proposed a residential tower on the parking lot and the old Brewery building being a creative office building. The most recent announced plans included this site as part of the Amazon HQ2 proposal by Hillwood. Neither has show sign of moving forward yet.

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maconahey
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Re: West End 1.0

Postby maconahey » 15 May 2018 22:08

Image

Tnexster
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Re: West End 1.0

Postby Tnexster » 18 May 2018 21:20

Looks like two more floors here.

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R1070
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Re: West End 1.0

Postby R1070 » 21 May 2018 21:47

I wish the surface lot next to it would turn into a garage. They could make some money off of the parking there.

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Tivo_Kenevil
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Re: West End 1.0

Postby Tivo_Kenevil » 22 May 2018 16:20

R1070 wrote:I wish the surface lot next to it would turn into a garage. They could make some money off of the parking there.


That's redundant. There's already one two blocks up; West end parking garage.
There's tons of parking under woodall as well.

I think a new office or residential tower would be great. It would help bridge VP and West End a little bit more.

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Re: West End 1.0

Postby Tnexster » 22 May 2018 20:57

Tivo_Kenevil wrote:
R1070 wrote:I wish the surface lot next to it would turn into a garage. They could make some money off of the parking there.


That's redundant. There's already one two blocks up; West end parking garage.
There's tons of parking under woodall as well.

I think a new office or residential tower would be great. It would help bridge VP and West End a little bit more.


So basically a parking garage with a residential tower on top.

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kingpin
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Re: West End 1.0

Postby kingpin » 26 May 2018 14:39

Corgan expansion 5/26/18

ImageUntitled by Around My City, on Flickr

ImageUntitled by Around My City, on Flickr
ImageUntitled by Around My City, on Flickr
ImageUntitled by Around My City, on Flickr

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maconahey
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Re: West End 1.0

Postby maconahey » 06 Jun 2018 16:51

Image

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kingpin
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Re: West End 1.0

Postby kingpin » 10 Jun 2018 20:50

ImageUntitled by Around My City, on Flickr
ImageUntitled by Around My City, on Flickr
ImageUntitled by Around My City, on Flickr

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maconahey
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Re: West End 1.0

Postby maconahey » 18 Jun 2018 16:16

Image

Tnexster
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Re: West End 1.0

Postby Tnexster » 18 Jun 2018 21:05

I kinda like the way this building is giving West End some height on the far side.

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maconahey
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Re: West End 1.0

Postby maconahey » 19 Jun 2018 15:44

Looks like this is from 2016 so I'm not sure if it's still in the works or not.

Image

http://www.bokapowell.com/dallas-innova ... iving-lab/
http://www.dallasinnovationalliance.com ... labvision/

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Re: West End 1.0

Postby Tnexster » 19 Jun 2018 21:37

One thing I wish Dallas would do better is rooftop green space.

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R1070
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Re: West End 1.0

Postby R1070 » 19 Jun 2018 21:49

Tnexster wrote:One thing I wish Dallas would do better is rooftop green space.


It would probably need to be some sort of artificial turf though because the direct sun and heat would kill it off unless you watered it a lot which isn't good either.

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Re: West End 1.0

Postby cowboyeagle05 » 20 Jun 2018 08:30

Well considering the heart of the West End revival the Dallas Entrepreneur Center moved out a lot of this stuff is bound to never happen. The DEC got absorbed into Capital Factory who moved into the Centrum in the gaybourhood. The DEC is also where the Dallas Innovation Alliance the one making all those technology-driven changes was located. Leadership at the DEC was the main driver to the Dallas Innovation Alliance so its possible a lot of the air has gone out of that balloon. The West End aka the city of Dallas may not get the real benefit of the smart city projects they were experimenting with. Most of the leadership has drifted off into other projects not tied to the West End revival.

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Re: West End 1.0

Postby kingpin » 04 Jul 2018 13:01

corgan expansion

ImageUntitled by Around My City, on Flickr

ImageUntitled by Around My City, on Flickr

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maconahey
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Re: West End 1.0

Postby maconahey » 13 Jul 2018 12:50

Image

Tnexster
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Re: West End 1.0

Postby Tnexster » 27 Jul 2018 14:27

Sam's Club to open a technology office separate from Walmart in downtown Dallas

https://www.dallasnews.com/business/ret ... own-dallas

The move into the new technology office will be completed in August, said Walmart spokeswoman Anne Hatfield. These employees have been working in co-working spaces and out of the Southlake Sam's Club, she said. Granite Properties has spent $77 million to renovate the seven-story building. It dates back to 1903, and Granite renamed it Factory Six-03. The 215,000-square-foot building's other tenants include the innovation lab for Richardson-based Blue Cross Blue Shield.

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Re: West End 1.0

Postby lakewoodhobo » 13 Aug 2018 15:02

West End Hotel Project Tries Playing Nice With Dallas’ Most Historic Parking Garage
https://dallas.towers.net/2018/08/13/we ... ng-garage/

Anderson’s client, Irving-based hotel developer Icon Lodging, wants to convert the building into a 120-foot-tall boutique hotel — but the height limit in the West End is 100 feet. Commissioners acknowledged that some buildings at the periphery of the district have slightly exceeded the height limit, but never in the heart of the West End.

The building at 711 Elm Street has no name, because it’s a parking garage — but it was downtown’s first multi-level parking structure when it was erected in 1925 to serve customers of the Sanger Brothers Department Store, making it a historic parking garage.

Image

DPatel304
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Re: West End 1.0

Postby DPatel304 » 13 Aug 2018 15:15

So far I'm liking the sound of this project. I agree the color does look like it might be a bit too dark, but the article does say they are willing to compromise.

Going into the hearing for comments, Anderson said the upper two stories of the existing garage will be converted to guestrooms. The plan is currently to keep 65 parking spaces in what was originally a 137-space garage with 7,200 square feet of retail.


More density to the neighborhood and less room for cars, sounds like a good change to me. If they can get this to look nice and fit in with the neighborhood, then I'm all for it.

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Re: West End 1.0

Postby Matt777 » 13 Aug 2018 15:46

I'm okay with the idea of it, but wow could they have designed the addition to be any more incongruent, jarring, mismatched, and generally fugly?

I am guessing that since they require a height variance, they made this ugly will say they can enhance the design as a concession for receiving the height variance..... I'm so tired of developers playing games like that in Dallas. In successful cities, this developer would just be shown the door on this proposal.

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Re: West End 1.0

Postby Matt777 » 13 Aug 2018 15:51

Also, I don't buy the "boutique hotel" proposal at all.... this developer only does chains like Hampton Inn, La Quinta, Residence Inn, Best Western, Motel 8, and Motel 6 etc. This crap design could easily be a Motel 6. As a downtown resident, a Motel 6 or any of the aforementioned chains is not a good enough add to have to look at this complete turd of a structure every day. Burns my eyes.

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Re: West End 1.0

Postby Tivo_Kenevil » 13 Aug 2018 16:34

Matt777 wrote:Also, I don't buy the "boutique hotel" proposal at all.... this developer only does chains like Hampton Inn, La Quinta, Residence Inn, Best Western, Motel 8, and Motel 6 etc. This crap design could easily be a Motel 6. As a downtown resident, a Motel 6 or any of the aforementioned chains is not a good enough add to have to look at this complete turd of a structure every day. Burns my eyes.


Yeah, that's what im thinking. I'm skeptical. I'd like to know who the client is beforehand...

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Re: West End 1.0

Postby Tnexster » 13 Aug 2018 16:50

Isn't that garage like 100 years old?

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mdg109
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Re: West End 1.0

Postby mdg109 » 13 Aug 2018 18:30

Yeah, not liking this rendering either, but a good addition to this part of West End if done right. Drove by yesterday evening, and this area is still pretty rough.

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R1070
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Re: West End 1.0

Postby R1070 » 13 Aug 2018 20:24

Can't they just eat up a surface lot right around there? We need some of those smaller surface lots to be redeveloped to connect with the core of downtown better.

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vman
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Re: West End 1.0

Postby vman » 14 Aug 2018 07:35

That rendering is awful; it looks like two buildings mating with each other. Hopefully they come back with something better.

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Re: West End 1.0

Postby cowboyeagle05 » 14 Aug 2018 08:37

Two things, the new structure has to be obvious from a different era so keep that in mind. One of the requirements is a new addition to historic structures like this needs to use materials that appeal to the past but they can not confuse people into thinking they are original additions. DFWcre8tive can explain these rules better than me since he has experience in that area but I do think its a hard balance sometimes trying to appeal to historical context and adapting old structures for new uses.

I do agree on the hotel flag question though. With this being right on the West End DART station I doubt a high-end brand wants to fight the culture that DART has been trying to wrangle for some time. Plus the Elm street side is the back of El Centro aka its loading dock so it's not a pleasant walk until you starting heading down Market Street where at least there are some nice sidewalks with trees, pavings, and a few restaurants. Plus they want to keep 7Eleven? We all know 7Eleven is a mixed bag of a tenant. They provide some needed options better than what was in the past Downtown during the early days but they tend to be the hangout spot for the homeless and those begging for handouts. Even if the Hotel has a security guard they will have to stay outside and circle the building to run people off consistently.

I do think what will help the DART station issues is a significantly sized project larger than this one that will create more advocacy for improvements and add more foot traffic that will help rebalance the area. Right now a number of residents are constantly trying to push DART, City of Dallas, and the Dallas Police to handle bad eggs but you need companies and more people who care to outnumber the rate of issues. West End station is the busiest station in DART's network and they plan to add a second underground station next to it and make it the hub of Downtown and hubs can be great economic drivers when done right. They should attract shopping, hotels, office space etc. Right now we have a church that tries to make an impact, McDonald's, a donut shop and a liquor store.

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muncien
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Re: West End 1.0

Postby muncien » 14 Aug 2018 09:54

R1070 wrote:Can't they just eat up a surface lot right around there? We need some of those smaller surface lots to be redeveloped to connect with the core of downtown better.


Totally!
The funny thing is, I actually really like the design of the addition... just NOT when it's placed directly on top of the existing structure, lol. Build it next door, convert the top two floors of the old structure, along with some restoration, and call it a day. That would be a huge benefit to the area.
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DPatel304
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Re: West End 1.0

Postby DPatel304 » 14 Aug 2018 10:18

muncien wrote:Totally!
The funny thing is, I actually really like the design of the addition... just NOT when it's placed directly on top of the existing structure, lol. Build it next door, convert the top two floors of the old structure, along with some restoration, and call it a day. That would be a huge benefit to the area.


That actually makes more sense. I'd say it's only a matter of time before SOMETHING gets built on that lot next door to it, and, once that does get built, it's possible it could block the windows of this propose hotel. It is to their benefit to build on that empty lot and avoid that situation all together.

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Re: West End 1.0

Postby lakewoodhobo » 14 Aug 2018 11:11

Wouldn't mind seeing a hotel on the parking lot next to the Purse Building. Great views of Founders Plaza and even the JFK memorial.

Screen Shot 2018-08-14 at 10.44.45 AM.jpg


I believe this was one of the proposed sites for City Hall before they chose Marilla.
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R1070
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Re: West End 1.0

Postby R1070 » 14 Aug 2018 21:17

This would be a great space for infill. There's so many small lots on the Western end of downtown that could be developed nicely.

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Re: West End 1.0

Postby dfwcre8tive » 15 Aug 2018 01:27

cowboyeagle05 wrote:Two things, the new structure has to be obvious from a different era so keep that in mind. One of the requirements is a new addition to historic structures like this needs to use materials that appeal to the past but they can not confuse people into thinking they are original additions. DFWcre8tive can explain these rules better than me since he has experience in that area but I do think its a hard balance sometimes trying to appeal to historical context and adapting old structures for new uses.


Correct. And the setback here from Elm Street would preserve some of the view of the facade. It needs to look non-historic but also look compatible and follow guidelines for the district. While they seem to be going in the right direction design-wise, I don't personally like it and agree with others that they should put this on one of the many empty lots in the area instead.

West End Historic District: http://dallascityhall.com/departments/s ... t_end.aspx


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