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Re: Deep Ellum: Epic ~ Knights of Pythias Temple

Posted: 13 Jun 2019 10:08
by lakewoodhobo
DPatel304 wrote:
cowboyeagle05 wrote:Bottle Blonde will also have to go...


I'm guessing they'll just lease in another nearby space. With Clutch coming to this area, I think this particular part of town is just getting started as the next party spot.


Here is some additional info on the Clutch/Concrete Cowboy sibling to be called Vice Park:

A group comprised of Valz, Rico Taylor and Dan Wierck is looking to raise $4.5 million in an equity round under the LLC "Everybody Wants Some," according to a regulatory filing.

Valz said that 20,000-square-foot concept will be called Vice Park.

It is expected to be a high-volume bar and night club located at the corner of Good Latimer Expressway between Floyd Street and Gaston Avenue, across the street from The Epic. The group plans to renovate the existing building, converting it into a two-story space with a rooftop area and parking lot.

Coeval Studio, the firm behind Dallas projects like Happiest Hour and The Rustic, will serve as designer and architect on the space.

Image

https://www.bizjournals.com/dallas/news ... -park.html

Re: Deep Ellum: Epic ~ Knights of Pythias Temple

Posted: 13 Jun 2019 11:14
by exelone31
Are they going to knock down the building then? This doesn't really look anything like it.

I've got to think that there's going to be a splitting of Deep Ellum into two districts. Maybe not two totally different names, but something like 6th Street and "Dirty 6th" in Austin.

Re: Deep Ellum: Epic ~ Knights of Pythias Temple

Posted: 13 Jun 2019 11:44
by DPatel304
So does that mean Clutch is staying in Uptown, and this is a sister bar?

Edit:
It looks like the same group has plans for another place called "The Sporting Club" in Deep Ellum:
https://www.soclutchgroup.com/location/ ... ub-dallas/

Re: Deep Ellum: Epic ~ Knights of Pythias Temple

Posted: 13 Jun 2019 16:25
by quixomniac
exelone31 wrote:Are they going to knock down the building then? This doesn't really look anything like it.

I've got to think that there's going to be a splitting of Deep Ellum into two districts. Maybe not two totally different names, but something like 6th Street and "Dirty 6th" in Austin.


can we petition for names?
Id prefer a play on words, Deep ellum, Deeper Ellum, and Deepest ellum ;)

Re: Deep Ellum: Epic ~ Knights of Pythias Temple

Posted: 13 Jun 2019 16:26
by DPatel304
quixomniac wrote:Id prefer a play on words, Deep ellum, Deeper Ellum, and Deepest ellum ;)


I really wouldn't be surprised if that caught on, considering we currently have Lower Greenville and Lowest Greenville.

Re: Deep Ellum: Epic ~ Knights of Pythias Temple

Posted: 14 Jun 2019 00:10
by willyk
DPatel304 wrote:
quixomniac wrote:Id prefer a play on words, Deep ellum, Deeper Ellum, and Deepest ellum ;)


I really wouldn't be surprised if that caught on, considering we currently have Lower Greenville and Lowest Greenville.



Cheap Ellum

Re: Deep Ellum: Epic ~ Knights of Pythias Temple

Posted: 14 Jun 2019 09:32
by Tivo_Kenevil
Everything west of Good Latimer, outside of the CBD, should be called NoGood. That way it will be the sister neighborhood of SoGood and also give homage to the people who frequent the establishments in the neighborhood. "Where you going?"..."I'm up to NoGood"

Re: Deep Ellum: Epic ~ Knights of Pythias Temple

Posted: 14 Jun 2019 11:23
by cowboyeagle05
I say Gooder Park

Re: Deep Ellum: Epic ~ Knights of Pythias Temple

Posted: 14 Jul 2019 05:00
by willyk
‘Epitome of Mixed Use’: Old Meets New in Deep Ellum’s The Epic Development

Developers are preserving history and building blocks of sustainability in one of Dallas' most historic neighborhoods.

https://dallasinnovates.com/epitome-of- ... velopment/

Re: Deep Ellum: Epic ~ Knights of Pythias Temple

Posted: 26 Jul 2019 09:46
by Jay9398
This may wind up as a separate thread if it actually goes forward, but...

Plat application has been submitted to the city for "Westdale Epic 2". Proposed land use is all commercial.

This is located on the ~2 acre property immediately west of the current construction site. Otherwise bounded by 345, Pacific, and Elm.

Re: Deep Ellum: Epic ~ Knights of Pythias Temple

Posted: 26 Jul 2019 11:07
by Tivo_Kenevil
Uber speculation intensifies.....

Re: Deep Ellum: Epic ~ Knights of Pythias Temple

Posted: 26 Jul 2019 11:08
by Tnexster
Jay9398 wrote:This may wind up as a separate thread if it actually goes forward, but...

Plat application has been submitted to the city for "Westdale Epic 2". Proposed land use is all commercial.

This is located on the ~2 acre property immediately west of the current construction site. Otherwise bounded by 345, Pacific, and Elm.


I thought this was the tower that would be built if Uber landed here.

Re: Deep Ellum: Epic ~ Knights of Pythias Temple

Posted: 26 Jul 2019 12:18
by exelone31
Epic 2: More Epic-er

Re: Deep Ellum: Epic ~ Knights of Pythias Temple

Posted: 26 Jul 2019 12:27
by DPatel304
They could follow Clutch's lead, and go with "So Epic".

Re: Deep Ellum: Epic ~ Knights of Pythias Temple

Posted: 26 Jul 2019 13:52
by clcrash19
Didn't someone say recently on here that they heard the uber thing was pretty much a done deal?

Re: Deep Ellum: Epic ~ Knights of Pythias Temple

Posted: 26 Jul 2019 13:54
by DPatel304
We've gotten close a couple times recently, so I'm going to wait until it's official to get excited. With that said, this does seem like the most likely relocation out of the most recent ones (Lowe's and Amazon).

Re: Deep Ellum: Epic ~ Knights of Pythias Temple

Posted: 26 Jul 2019 13:55
by dd_dweller
If uber does open up an office at the Epic, I hope they build a platform on whatever building they build. I think that's what the new buildings will be adding as an amenity. Would be cool to see that in phase 2.

Re: Deep Ellum: Epic ~ Knights of Pythias Temple

Posted: 26 Jul 2019 14:38
by Tivo_Kenevil
Mo' Epic should be the new name. Just sayin'

Re: Deep Ellum: Epic ~ Knights of Pythias Temple

Posted: 12 Aug 2019 12:20
by Tnexster
New Dallas building on the way could house thousands of Uber workers

https://www.dallasnews.com/business/rea ... er-workers

Westdale has received approvals to close Hawkins Street between Elm and Pacific Avenue to accommodate the next construction.

"We have a second phase almost as large as the first phase," Westdale CEO Joe Beard said earlier this year.

Re: Deep Ellum: Epic ~ Knights of Pythias Temple

Posted: 12 Aug 2019 12:34
by Tivo_Kenevil
Interested in what the next phase will look like.

Re: Deep Ellum: Epic ~ Knights of Pythias Temple

Posted: 12 Aug 2019 13:20
by homeworld1031tx
Uber just announced a tech hiring freeze today, which comes a few weeks after they just laid off another ~500 people in their marketing department. This company does not have legs and I really hope they're not coming into the city due to a 'benefit now, pay later' tax break. They won't be around to pay later.

Re: Deep Ellum: Epic ~ Knights of Pythias Temple

Posted: 12 Aug 2019 13:47
by Tucy
Do we have any idea what other cities might be in the running for the 3,000 Uber jobs?

Re: Deep Ellum: Epic ~ Knights of Pythias Temple

Posted: 12 Aug 2019 14:15
by Tnexster
Phoenix was one

Re: Deep Ellum: Epic ~ Knights of Pythias Temple

Posted: 12 Aug 2019 14:27
by Matt777
homeworld1031tx wrote:Uber just announced a tech hiring freeze today, which comes a few weeks after they just laid off another ~500 people in their marketing department. This company does not have legs and I really hope they're not coming into the city due to a 'benefit now, pay later' tax break. They won't be around to pay later.


I heard about the layoffs a couple weeks ago, so a hiring freeze is not a surprise. This could bode well for Dallas' chances of landing the tech hub as they will spend much less per employee here than in the Bay Area. The hiring freeze may be to prevent further hiring in the Bay Area when they plan to move those operations elsewhere. Who knows, maybe even an HQ relocation to get out of the crushing Bay Area salary costs and taxes.

I see this as a speedbump for Uber. I don't think they're going anywhere but up in the future. Mobility is changing.

Re: Deep Ellum: Epic ~ Knights of Pythias Temple

Posted: 12 Aug 2019 15:25
by homeworld1031tx
Matt777 wrote:
homeworld1031tx wrote:Uber just announced a tech hiring freeze today, which comes a few weeks after they just laid off another ~500 people in their marketing department. This company does not have legs and I really hope they're not coming into the city due to a 'benefit now, pay later' tax break. They won't be around to pay later.


I heard about the layoffs a couple weeks ago, so a hiring freeze is not a surprise. This could bode well for Dallas' chances of landing the tech hub as they will spend much less per employee here than in the Bay Area. The hiring freeze may be to prevent further hiring in the Bay Area when they plan to move those operations elsewhere. Who knows, maybe even an HQ relocation to get out of the crushing Bay Area salary costs and taxes.

I see this as a speedbump for Uber. I don't think they're going anywhere but up in the future. Mobility is changing.



A wholesale HQ or at least operational HQ shift would be my other bet for this, so maybe that is indeed why the freeze was put in place.

Way off topic but I still don't think Uber has legs. They don't provide a significantly unique service, offer every ride at a loss, and are not well positioned to take advantage of autonomous driving when it does eventually roll out en masse over the next decade. After their 5B write off this quarter due to lock ups expiring, I think they're down to 7B in the bank and a burn rate of 1B/quarter with nothing promising on the horizon. I just don't see it working out.

Re: Deep Ellum: Epic ~ Knights of Pythias Temple

Posted: 12 Aug 2019 15:47
by cowboyeagle05
homeworld1031tx wrote:Uber just announced a tech hiring freeze today, which comes a few weeks after they just laid off another ~500 people in their marketing department. This company does not have legs and I really hope they're not coming into the city due to a 'benefit now, pay later' tax break. They won't be around to pay later.


According to the last article, I read Uber wouldn't get the money until they meet the numbers they are promising for hiring.

Re: Deep Ellum: Epic ~ Knights of Pythias Temple

Posted: 13 Aug 2019 14:48
by dd_dweller
https://retailtxok.cbre.us/wp-content/u ... preads.pdf

Page 11 has a rendering of phase II or possibly just a placeholder of what could be built. Looks fairly new. Never seen this before.

Re: Deep Ellum: Epic ~ Knights of Pythias Temple

Posted: 13 Aug 2019 15:10
by cowboyeagle05
Looks like a placeholder concept rendering to me. I am sure they used something similar to snag a meeting with Uber but I bet a more designed tower is what Uber has seen in meetings along with city and state officials who have been in final discussions. That looks like a massing rendering which is common to show the possibility of additional phases.

Re: Deep Ellum: Epic ~ Knights of Pythias Temple

Posted: 13 Aug 2019 22:29
by jsoto3
I'd be surprised to see Uber relocate their headquarters outside of San Francisco given that they are spending hundreds of millions constructing a highly-custom office complex with an innovative design in Mission Bay to serve as their new global HQ.

https://missionbay2020.com/vision
https://www.shoparc.com/projects/uber-hq/
https://www.architectmagazine.com/desig ... quarters_o
https://www.bisnow.com/san-francisco/ne ... mpus-82493

Re: Deep Ellum: Epic ~ Knights of Pythias Temple

Posted: 14 Aug 2019 21:29
by cowboyeagle05
It's a second HQ, not a relocation which has been discussed before.

Re: Deep Ellum: Epic ~ Knights of Pythias Temple

Posted: 14 Aug 2019 22:07
by dallaz
According to NBC5, Uber is officially moving to Deep Ellum. Also up to 5 additional buildings are planned on the adjacent land. (Info from the 10 o’clock news)

Re: Deep Ellum: Epic ~ Knights of Pythias Temple

Posted: 14 Aug 2019 22:40
by Cord1936
Image

Uber Acquires Dallas Office Space for Up to 3,000 Jobs: Sources
By Ken Kalthoff, NBC5 News, Published 6 hours ago | Updated 12 minutes ago

Uber has acquired office space in a new Deep Ellum development with plans to bring a major office to Dallas, sources say.

The ride-share giant has space at The Epic, a new development on Pacific Avenue, and bought at least two large parcels of land around it for up to five office buildings in the coming years, NBC 5's Ken Kalthoff reported Wednesday.

Earlier Wednesday, the Dallas City Council approved a $9 million incentive package to try to lure Uber to North Texas.

Dallas County Commissioners were expected to vote on more incentives for Uber next week.

The move could bring up to 3,000 new jobs to Uber's potential Dallas office, which would include things like development of autonomous vehicles and flying cars.

Dallas Mayor Eric Johnson released the following statement in response to the council vote:

"I am thrilled for Dallas and for Uber Technologies. Uber's expansion will bring thousands of high-paying jobs and a $110 million investment to our city's core, which has long driven our region’s explosive growth.

"The City Council's vote for this competitive economic incentive package illustrates Dallas' continued commitment to innovation and strengthening its workforce. We are looking forward to hopefully welcoming Uber to Dallas very soon."


Link: https://www.nbcdfw.com/news/local/Dalla ... 66411.html

Re: Deep Ellum: Epic ~ Knights of Pythias Temple

Posted: 14 Aug 2019 22:58
by Tnexster
If this holds together score a big win for downtown. This will certainly change things on the east edge of downtown and beyond.

Re: Deep Ellum: Epic ~ Knights of Pythias Temple

Posted: 14 Aug 2019 23:00
by Tivo_Kenevil
dallaz wrote:According to NBC5, Uber is officially moving to Deep Ellum. Also up to 5 additional buildings are planned on the adjacent land. (Info from the 10 o’clock news)


I'd like to learn more about these buildings. Things are looking troubling for Uber at the moment; Wall St has been brutal to their stock. I wonder how the jobs comin' here will play out

Re: Deep Ellum: Epic ~ Knights of Pythias Temple

Posted: 14 Aug 2019 23:13
by dallaz
Tivo_Kenevil wrote:
dallaz wrote:According to NBC5, Uber is officially moving to Deep Ellum. Also up to 5 additional buildings are planned on the adjacent land. (Info from the 10 o’clock news)


I'd like to learn more about these buildings. Things are looking troubling for Uber at the moment; Wall St has been brutal to their stock. I wonder how the jobs comin' here will play out

Same here. I have a lot of the same questions. Maybe they think they will be more successful in Dallas. Lower cost of living, lower regulations, etc. will prolly help them...?

To be honest, I’m kinda uneasy about it...but I also like the idea of 3,000 high paying jobs. But I’m just not sure if it’s totally feasible right now. Hell, maybe they know something that we don’t, but as of right now, many people are saying the same thing. And it is nothing wrong with being concerned about a company that recently lost billions...

Re: Deep Ellum: Epic ~ Knights of Pythias Temple

Posted: 14 Aug 2019 23:54
by Tivo_Kenevil
dallaz wrote:
Tivo_Kenevil wrote:
dallaz wrote:According to NBC5, Uber is officially moving to Deep Ellum. Also up to 5 additional buildings are planned on the adjacent land. (Info from the 10 o’clock news)


I'd like to learn more about these buildings. Things are looking troubling for Uber at the moment; Wall St has been brutal to their stock. I wonder how the jobs comin' here will play out

Same here. I have a lot of the same questions. Maybe they think they will be more successful in Dallas. Lower cost of living, lower regulations, etc. will prolly help them...?

To be honest, I’m kinda uneasy about it...but I also like the idea of 3,000 high paying jobs. But I’m just not sure if it’s totally feasible right now. Hell, maybe they know something that we don’t, but as of right now, many people are saying the same thing. And it is nothing wrong with being concerned about a company that recently lost billions...


From Dallas' perspective it's a no brainier though...I view it like this though. This 9 Million in incentives can actually go further than just Tax Dollars from new developments. It is also a signal to other companies (specifically Tech) that Dallas has the workforce to fill high skilled positions.

If this plays out well, it can be the start of a new day for Dallas. Furthermore, it speaks volume to investment made in Downtown since Boeing's spurn.

Even if Uber ends up on Rocky roads (Pun intended); Dallas still looks good.

Re: Deep Ellum: Epic ~ Knights of Pythias Temple

Posted: 15 Aug 2019 00:28
by clcrash19
Its 100 percent a no brainer for Dallas.. this is a huge win for downtown no matter what happens long term to Uber, only helps with our tech talent pool and office absorption.

Re: Deep Ellum: Epic ~ Knights of Pythias Temple

Posted: 15 Aug 2019 01:50
by dallaz
Tivo_Kenevil wrote:
dallaz wrote:
Tivo_Kenevil wrote:
I'd like to learn more about these buildings. Things are looking troubling for Uber at the moment; Wall St has been brutal to their stock. I wonder how the jobs comin' here will play out

Same here. I have a lot of the same questions. Maybe they think they will be more successful in Dallas. Lower cost of living, lower regulations, etc. will prolly help them...?

To be honest, I’m kinda uneasy about it...but I also like the idea of 3,000 high paying jobs. But I’m just not sure if it’s totally feasible right now. Hell, maybe they know something that we don’t, but as of right now, many people are saying the same thing. And it is nothing wrong with being concerned about a company that recently lost billions...


From Dallas' perspective it's a no brainier though...I view it like this though. This 9 Million in incentives can actually go further than just Tax Dollars from new developments. It is also a signal to other companies (specifically Tech) that Dallas has the workforce to fill high skilled positions.

If this plays out well, it can be the start of a new day for Dallas. Furthermore, it speaks volume to investment made in Downtown since Boeing's spurn.

Even if Uber ends up on Rocky roads (Pun intended); Dallas still looks good.

I didn’t look at it that way and it seems to make a lot of sense.

Re: Deep Ellum: Epic ~ Knights of Pythias Temple

Posted: 15 Aug 2019 03:51
by willyk
And KDC appears to be on a hot streak—Toyota, State Farm, Liberty Mutual, etc. and now this. They built the Epic on spec, so they get extra credit for this one. I wonder if they played a role in recruiting Uber to Dallas, or if Uber selected Dallas first then KDC.

Re: Deep Ellum: Epic ~ Knights of Pythias Temple

Posted: 15 Aug 2019 08:02
by itsjrd1964
Where will 5 office buildings go? Isn't there supposed to be another residential building at Epic, or no? Even with what hasn't been built on between Elm and Pacific, that wouldn't fit 4 more office buildings. There's been no word up to now that Epic will have more land than what's been built on (and used for construction staging). There is a building north of Pacific for sale/lease. I don't know if that big vacant lot to the north is available, nor the Midtowne Spa or that other place next to it. All that land would definitely fit more office buildings.

If the Uber deal comes together in full, along with the Uptown clubs/bars moving down that way, that whole area will really be buzzing.

Re: Deep Ellum: Epic ~ Knights of Pythias Temple

Posted: 15 Aug 2019 08:54
by eburress
This is fantastic news! And imagine the transformation in the area if a few of these other towers, as well as the inevitable related development, happens...

Re. the additional parcels, there is the land immediately behind the Epic, but you'd have to assume some of this additional land is on the Downtown side of I-345.

Re: Deep Ellum: Epic ~ Knights of Pythias Temple

Posted: 15 Aug 2019 09:05
by eburress
itsjrd1964 wrote:Where will 5 office buildings go? Isn't there supposed to be another residential building at Epic, or no? Even with what hasn't been built on between Elm and Pacific, that wouldn't fit 4 more office buildings. There's been no word up to now that Epic will have more land than what's been built on (and used for construction staging). There is a building north of Pacific for sale/lease. I don't know if that big vacant lot to the north is available, nor the Midtowne Spa or that other place next to it. All that land would definitely fit more office buildings.

If the Uber deal comes together in full, along with the Uptown clubs/bars moving down that way, that whole area will really be buzzing.


There is the parking lot across Pacific/Gaston, between the Epic and Bottled Blonde/The Backyard, but my understanding was that everything in that block was going to be razed to build the entrance to the Dart D2 subway.

Re: Deep Ellum: Epic ~ Knights of Pythias Temple

Posted: 15 Aug 2019 09:44
by DPatel304
Tivo_Kenevil wrote:From Dallas' perspective it's a no brainier though...I view it like this though. This 9 Million in incentives can actually go further than just Tax Dollars from new developments. It is also a signal to other companies (specifically Tech) that Dallas has the workforce to fill high skilled positions.

If this plays out well, it can be the start of a new day for Dallas. Furthermore, it speaks volume to investment made in Downtown since Boeing's spurn.

Even if Uber ends up on Rocky roads (Pun intended); Dallas still looks good.


Great point and well said. I even felt this way about the whole Amazon HQ2 ordeal. Even though we didn't win, the fact that we were in the running until the very end was great publicity for our city. The same will be true here.

So, are we thinking that the reason DART is moving the Deep Ellum station, rather than eliminating it altogether might have something to do with this Uber deal? Or is the timing just coincidental.

I remember how much the Toyota move put Plano and DFW on the map back then, and how much other development followed shortly after.

Re: Deep Ellum: Epic ~ Knights of Pythias Temple

Posted: 15 Aug 2019 11:26
by clcrash19
There is no doubt that being a finalist and getting the pub from the amazon searched helped us a lot going forward.

Re: Deep Ellum: Epic ~ Knights of Pythias Temple

Posted: 15 Aug 2019 13:41
by eburress
clcrash19 wrote:There is no doubt that being a finalist and getting the pub from the amazon searched helped us a lot going forward.

Surely it didn't hurt, but Uber had already selected Dallas to be one of the three launch cities for their flying taxi service so clearly we were already on their radar. :)

Re: Deep Ellum: Epic ~ Knights of Pythias Temple

Posted: 16 Aug 2019 16:42
by cowboyeagle05
UBer likes Dallas cause we a are a car city and mass transit here is a vanity project for some rather than a real solution to Dallas transportation issues. Dallas is business-friendly in general, we use Uber fluidly and we are spread out so it's a great testbed and working city for the Uber model whether that's by car or a flying contraption they are playing with.

Re: Deep Ellum: Epic ~ Knights of Pythias Temple

Posted: 16 Aug 2019 19:47
by citygeek
Well Uber HQ's are in San Francisco, a very mass transit oriented city so there's that.

Re: Deep Ellum: Epic ~ Knights of Pythias Temple

Posted: 16 Aug 2019 21:51
by utgf
So is Lyft's. Their initial success was dependent on providing a better taxi service and from customer standpoint have succeeded admirably.

Re: Deep Ellum: Epic ~ Knights of Pythias Temple

Posted: 17 Aug 2019 10:39
by cowboyeagle05
citygeek wrote:Well Uber HQ's are in San Francisco, a very mass transit oriented city so there's that.


yes but I doubt that's a big determining factor for Uber in that case. The access to talent and the industry of startups etc is what San Francisco is about.

Re: Deep Ellum: Epic ~ Knights of Pythias Temple

Posted: 17 Aug 2019 11:24
by citygeek
Gee, really?